quote: Firaxis is focusing much of its efforts on creating a more dynamic and entertaining trade system than the one found in previous games. "Trade was really abstract in the two [previous Civilization] games," Briggs said. "You would build caravans and move them yourself from city to city, moving them in the right place. I thought that was cumbersome." To change all of that, Firaxis is implementing two types of resources--luxury items and strategic resources--and depending on your strategy, you will want to make a concerted effort to control as many resources as possible. If you don't control as many valuable resources as other civilizations do, then you can either take the resources by force or establish strong trade relations.

this seems to mean that they won't be using camels, and the corresponing trade bonuses (matthew's infamous 1000 gold and science bonus) are probably history, too.

This system will probably be interesting, but I can't help but feel a sense of loss.

quote: so you mean they will trade with out camels? how will the goods get from one place to another?

Horses? Trains? Ships? Cargoplanes?

Hey, I can live without the good old camel. Letīs face it, it was not very wise in civ2 that all nations, american, european, whatever had camels as traders!

such as:
"we see that your civilization, although nearly insignificant, may be of some use to us in supplying us with silk. We are prepared to trade horses with you in exchange"

Agreed. let's make this trade agreement.
No way, we don't need your useless horses.
We would prefer you to supply us with Iron

quote: but camels are cool..

Real Camels. But to be serious I didnīt like the trade system in civ2, it was a bit boring to move all these slow camels around. Fatherīs idea sounds not bad to me.

In a sense this new way is wiser because road-building IS trade route building; but I confess to being one of those who spent many a Civ 2 game doing little else but happily moving my camels around the map setting up trade routes. I can envision enjoying building roads, etc., if the emphasis is on clarity and functionality, which are VERY different from simply being "hassle-free" (see CTP).

Hassle-free I don't need; direct control over imagining and creating my trade empire, YES, and to that end I must say I'm encouraged...

1.as in ctp you wont acctualy move them but you might need so many to make a trade route. and once it is established with a certain civ you can trade as much as you want.

2. (still using the unseen units) or you might need so many caravans for each trade route no matter how many routes allready excist between you and the civ.

3. finally you might need to move a caravan to establish a trade route with the civ, but once it is established, you can trade whatever you want.

Once trade agreement is made, trade route can be established. Then you assign your caravans(if the route is land based)or merchant ships(if the route is water based)to the specific trade routes.

Athens(Greek)<--------------------------->Alexandria(Egyptian)
25 merchant ships assigned

Corinth(Greek)<-------------------------->Crete(Cretan)
18 merchant ships assigned

Athens(Greek)<-------------------------->Ukraine(minor civ/tribes?)
20 caravans assigned

Sid Promised us that we would be able to negotiate for just about anything in diplomatic negotiations, and it seems that he has. check the diplomacy screen sreenshot.

The Good:
having it as part of diplomacy and interciv bargaining chips makes a lot more sense than the involuntary trade routes that persist through thick and thin. I listen to the news and hear various nations bickering about those very things.
I am also going to enjoy the fact that war deprives enemy nations of our trade goods, giving them and us an incentive for peace.

quote: Originally posted by raingoon on 05-18-2001 04:33 PM Father Beast, I interviewed someone inside the Civ franchise for my next column that speaks to the heart of the camel issue. I think you'll be surprised...

This sounds quite exciting, especially given how excellent your previous contribution was. When can we expect to see this?

quote: Originally posted by raingoon on 05-18-2001 04:33 PM Father Beast, I interviewed someone inside the Civ franchise for my next column that speaks to the heart of the camel issue. I think you'll be surprised...

Looking forward to it. more info is always good. hope they post it tonight!