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"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills, we shall never surrender!" -Winston Churchill

Having said that, if you simply have to have the Civ2 wonders, movies, units, etc, then go play Civ2. Or better yet, make your own since it isn't to likely they will sue an individual.

This is CtP2 which is an ENTIRELY different game and one, which I might add, that stands on its own.

I thought the original licence was for CtP1 and a single followup title.

Some say including myself, that CTP2 is little more than a expansion disc. So if Activision had admitted this and released it as an add-on disc, it would have saved them a lot of these copyright issues.

quote: Originally posted by The Viceroy on 12-19-2000 07:54 AM I completely agree with Red_Jon on this ... Personally, I think America is a continent, not a civilization .. United States maybe .. but not America. I always found it a little funny that I have the North Americans and Americans in the same game. As for it being an American game ... Well, .. how arragant can you get .. the modern world was not build by the US, you have contributed since WW2, and little before this time. Im reminded of my recent trip to Paris, where I heard an American tourist say "GEEE They really built this thing 100 years ago ??" regards to the Eiffel tower .. It may be a suprise to some of you Americans, but we (Europeans) were building empires while you were eating baked beans and firing guns at each other ... nothing much has changed since.

If it wasn't for us baked bean gun toating silly Americans you would be soluting hitler right now. And who cares about the Eiffel tower? It just proves you ppl didn't know how to build things back then either. I am next to a church right now that was bult in 1789 in Buffalo,NY I don't see that in the game and I wouldn't expect to. Plus the building isn't leaning though it is starting to fall apart ;-)

As for the game being to American I agree. I think they should make the wonders more general (i.e. Galilao's telescope eq Telescope and etc...)

You really are the most ignorant person I have ever had the misfortune to meet.

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"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills, we shall never surrender!" -Winston Churchill

quote: The canadians made us look bad by settling their election before the United States even though they voted for President after we did. I vote they get it

Canada is a constitutional monarchy which means that we have no president. Queen Elizabeth II is the monarch and so we have a prime minister.

Wonders of the world. Some people are complaining about the Empire State Building being a wonder of the world. No one complains about the Pyramids being a wonder of the world when, in fact, they were built to satisfy the vanity of pharoahs. I have just recently read that the pyramids are no great feat of architecture; it's the logistics of building such a thing that's the wonder. Instead of the Empire State Building being a wonder of the world maybe the Statue of Liberty should be a wonder since it came to be known by the whole world as the representation of democracy and freedom. I don't remember - was the Statue of Liberty a wonder in Civ2?

America is a european colony, didn´t you know ?

Well, 5 of the 7 Ancient Wonders of the world were Greek but they only Greek wonder is the Labyrinth which is accually not one of the 7 ancient ones. Labyrinth was a mythological place where the Minoans where droping young people as sacrifice to the Minotaur (which in Greek means Minoan's bull by the way ) and can't think how this could be related with free caravans, maybe I am missing something .

As for the Empire Building I thing it was a great achivement the time was builded. Maybe not a wonder or maybe a wonder, why not.

Regarding the American-Europian war that had started on this topic I think both have some share on what is fair. It is true that the Americans gave a great help to the Europians to the two world wars. Perhaps it is true that the Europians might have been enslaved to the Germans (which are Europians too ) if the Americans wouldn't help but if they hadn't, and the Germans had taken the entire Europe then the American would share the world with them and not with themselves right now . And do not forget what the Russians had contribute to the WWII. They beated the Japanese on the early stages of the war and they crashed the Germans. And the British cicked Adolf's butt in the Battle of England and in Egypt! Not to mention the contribution of other nations to the great war, French, Australians, Polish, Serbs, Greeks etc.

Do not forget that most of the American people and their ancestors are comming from the Europian continent. England, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Russia, Poland, Spain, France, Greece etc. and South American who have come mostly from Spain or Portugal too.
I consider most of the Americans more or less as Europians. Yeah I know that many Americans come from different places than Europe like Africa, China, Middle East, India etc but their society and economical model looks like a fresh and optimized Western Europian copy with only difference the luck of some Europian style . Am I getting bad? No just teasing. To say the truth you have managed in a century to kick our Europian butt and extremely contribute to scientific developement which is maybe the most important aspect of the humanity. We love you but do not forget that you own a bit of your success to us the Europians so give us some attention and include less American achievements to the games and more "world" achievents .

quote: Originally posted by Keygen on 12-27-2000 09:21 AM And do not forget what the Russians had contribute to the WWII. They beated the Japanese on the early stages of the war

Actually, they declared war on Japan after the Germans were defeated and they managed to capture only a few (3?) small islands before Japan surrendered to the US.

wonder this, wonder that, blah, blah, blah.... People want wonders and all the good ones were taken, so Activision took what they could. Personally, I've added Code of hammurabi, magna carta, the national guard. Oooops, I need more american wonders

Cant we all just get along????????????? Except the French, they can go away

quote: Originally posted by Keygen on 12-27-2000 07:05 PM Probably you don't know that the Russians had engaged in war between 1938 and 1939 with the Japanese before even the Germans got in war with the Russians. The Japanese were crushed by Zhuckov in the battle of Halhin Gol in Mongolian territory! We Europians know better history than you the Americans simply because we have some .

Damn, thats even before WW2 started!
And no, I didn't know about that but thats probably because it was unimportant and I don't care about all those little Japanese-Russian wars before WW2.

The Russians may have determined the outcome of the war in Europe but they certainly didn't help the war against Japan.

Oh and I'm a EuropEan btw

And Americans, don't forget: you still speak English! which comes from Europe (GB)
So don't think you are better than them (the Europeans) cuz you are them! (grammar?)

And about all those wonders coming from USA - it's just a game and you are put there to show the AI opponents that every country can rule the world (and build all the wonders). And what could you expect from an america-based company?

quote: Originally posted by Taranis on 12-27-2000 09:42 PM Damn, thats even before WW2 started! And no, I didn't know about that but thats probably because it was unimportant and I don't care about all those little Japanese-Russian wars before WW2. The Russians may have determined the outcome of the war in Europe but they certainly didn't help the war against Japan. Oh and I'm a EuropEan btw

Who cares if this war ended just a few days before or after (Augost or September of 1939) the world war II. The battle of Halhin Gol (or whatever it's its English spell) took place in 20 of Augost 1939. If the Japanese had won that war probably Russia whould had never existed as super power. Instead Germany and Japan whould had been the two super powers. USA then may had never had engaged in the WWII or even worst you could had your butt kicked . OK maybe I am a bit excessive but who could surrely know how things would have come if the Japanese or the Germans had won the Russian?

quote: Originally posted by jkadabomb on 12-28-2000 10:08 AM Alright I hate to admit this but America could kick any countries ass in any war so you might as well shut up.

Well, As I am aware you didn't trully kicked Vietnamise butt, right?

But the Aussies had to hold off against the "pride of the Japanese army" to majorly overwhelming odds in Papua New Guinea for almost a year and a half before the yanks could organise themselves to come over. If we hadn't of held the Japanese off at the Kakoda Trail in 1942 then the US wouldn't have had a chance of stopping them after Australia fell.

And if the Australian SAS (Commandos really) hadn't have helped the yanks out in Vietnam, then thousands of yanky soldiers would be dead/captured.

Oh, and don't forget the Aussie Aces who flew over England during the Battle of Britain, and the Aussies who slaughtered the Germans in France in WWI, and the million Turks that 20,000 Aussies wiped out at a pass in Palestine in WWI, and....., and......

The US a good army? PFFFFT! The Aussies are better trained and prepared. There might not be many of us, but it'd be damn expensive to try and beat us.

Personally, I liked the balance of ancient and modern wonders in civ2 and feel compelled to conquer the world before it gets too futuristic.

From the 1890s through the 1950s, Confederate organizations (Daughters of the Confederacy) dictated history cirriculum and glorified the dead Confederacy as a separate, legitimate nation that supported states' rights.

The truth has come out though. The Confederacy only supported states' rights when it served their interest. Note the Bleeding Kansas conflict when Missourian slaveholders sought to deny the non-slaveholding majority in Kansas a legitimate government. And the fact is that the Confederacy used the hypocritical states' rights as a facade - they really fought the Civil War to preserve slavery.

quote: Originally posted by CorpusScorpius on 12-31-2000 05:18 PM I have been trying to figure out whats up with this USA bashing. If an American says something the rest of the world doesnt like, we (useing the term loosely) are considered Arrogant. If the rest of the world has a complaint about the USA its A O K. There are many knowledgeble Americans just like there are many knowledgeable Europeans, Asians, ....etc. If the rest of the world would care to notice, Americans are proud of their WORLDY HERITAGE.....Chinese-American,Italian-American,Mexican-American,...etc. I understand we are the only Super-Power left but, over time these things change. U guys(the rest of the world),should seperate OUR Government's action from the average American Citizen. Oh yeah, thanks Western/Eastern Europe, U.K, Africa's many Nations, Middle East,Russia, Indian Sub Continent, & the rest of the world for their contributions (Immigrants, Science, & Money)to everyone's FAVORITE Cousin the good ol USA.

OMG, what have we come to when the texans are defending the USA. Dang, i thought you all still thought you were yer own country

NOTE TO (SOME) AMERICANS-

IF I SAY THAT IN CTP2 THERE ARE TOO MANY US WONDERS IT IS NOT AN INSULT TO YOUR COUNTRY. God

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"We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills, we shall never surrender!" -Winston Churchill