posted June 10, 1999 22:07                

"We're gonna rock this town, rock it inside out.
We're gonna rock this town, make 'm scream and shout..."

posted June 13, 1999 16:19                

1. I would like to have the leaders pictures of Civ I back (suitably up-dated of course) instead of the heralds of Civ II or CTP. It almost felt like one was speaking to Lenin or Gengis Khan and this added atmosphere.

2. I also like the CTP system of Ages but would like more of them (something like ANCIENT, CLASSICAL, MEDIEVAL, RENAISSANCE, INDUSTRIAL, MODERN & COMPUTER) m with city graphics that changed for each age and were different from each civilization or groups of civilizations, (Northern European, Oriental, New World, Meditarean, Near East, Native American, Indian (sub-continent), Russian & African) at least until the modern age.

3. There should be multiple Leaders that change over time for the AI controlled civilizations (at least one leader for each age if a system such as CTP was adopted). Additionally, when there is a revolution a leader should also be replaced. Each of these leaders should have a different personality that would effect the game play (Washington [no alliances, allows slavery] different than Lincoln [no slavery] who is different than Teddy Roosevelt [foreign expansion, alliances]). The number of revolutions could be dependant upon the civilization which could have a revolution variable/coefficient, e.g., it could be high for the French and lower for the British, etc.

4. Someone mentioned that they would like a General/Commander unit that would give a bonus when combined with a stack of units that would become an Army. Others thought that this was overkill and wouldn't add much fun to the game. A fun version of this might be a GREAT LEADER special unit/s for each civilization that MIGHT appear randomly throughout the game and that would have to effect of either a defensive bonus or offensive bonus while in a stack (like a General) or a happiness or scientific bonus for a city (perhaps like plus 5 happiness/science). These units could not be rebuilt once destroyed and would be specific to the age in which they arrived. Moreover they would last only as long as that Age to represent their life span (Modern, Renaissance etc.) Some of these could be for example, Julius Caesar, Napoleon, Churchill, Wellington, Richard the III, Gandhi, Lincoln, Hitler, Shakespeare, Alexander the Great, Aristotle, Newton, Plato, Einstein, Lenin, Mao etc. In some senses this would allow one to get rid of some of the Wonders that are tied to people and in some ways is like Colonization, except that enemies could try to destroy these units. This would help to make every game special.

5. Bring back the city national Flags of the scenarios. I loved these and they added atmosphere. Something else which would be nice would be to have smaller versions (or related versions) of these on ships.

6. For those that would like it should be possible to name ships and units/stacks to add atmosphere. When a battle was won the computer could say: "Prime Minister, the DREADNOUGHT or INVINCIBLE has won a great battle and has been promoted to veteran status!" or "Mr. President, the 5TH ARMY has taken Midway Island!".

7. I also like (for those that want it) the ability to name mountains/rivers, special natural resources (as some have called for). Then when you discovered something the computer could say: "My liege, we have discovered X, what should we name them?". These then could be used later for the end of game wrap-up, as was mentioned before.

posted June 14, 1999 20:40             

I would like to see some improvements to the atmospherics of warfare. The game would be improved if it reflected the damaging effects of warfare better. Some suggestions:

. When a city is conquered, it gives off a pall of smoke for a set period. This could be linked to a period in which the city is unproductive, possibly even until some reconstruction cost is paid or work is done. May inhibit civs without funds launching mega wars and could give the graphic effect of a swathe of burning cities where warfare is intense.

. Pillaging doesn't just remove improvements, it leaves a scar upon the land. This could be represented by a symbol similar that for pollution in civ I, or smoking ruins. To bring the land back to full production, the war damage would have to be removed first in the same way as pollution. Nuclear pollution should have permanent effects until a tech is developed (a future tech, not much we can do about it with current technolgy - witness Chernobyl, that part of the Ukraine is still unusable).

. Cities that are destroyed in gameplay are marked by ruins.

. Major land battles are marked by "trophies" (the Greek idea), a flag on the site or possibly war grave icons. Possession these sites may give a points bonus.

Anyone else have ideas along these lines?

posted June 15, 1999 07:18                

War is a bad thing, afterall.. players should feel some remorse at seeing their people being killed. At the very least the people should be angry at the player if things are going poorly. Even a winning war with a lot of losses is not ikely to be popular, nless the people see a good reason for it.

posted June 15, 1999 19:52             

Another idea, would be to work in an association between war and disease which tended to decimate both fighting and civilian populations, even in the modern period (VD hospitals alone on the Western Front in WWI had up to 500,000 patients on just the allied side and this was before anti-biotics). I don't know how the link could be worked in though - may be just graphically showing the population suffering in the city screen when besieged etc.

We don't want to make the game too gloomy but war is hell and the game might even be slightly educational on this point if it had things in it like war graves and smoking ruins - at least it would make people think a bit - who needs more Bosnia's and Kosovo's? On the other hand I can't quite believe I just wrote that because as a player I'm the greatest warmonger out and always end the game by subjugation - leaving one city whilst I build my score- but perhaps this is just because building the spaceship is so lame and there is little real incentive in Civ I or II to go for world peace.

posted June 15, 1999 22:07                

quote:

---

Yin's 3rd Regiment consisting of 2 light-armored tanks, a Stealth bomber, and 4 infantry engaged China's 53rd Elite Patrol Division, consisting of some rock throwers and a random guy with a small caliber handgun. The battle, which took place near Death Valley Ridge, lasted 3 days. Yin's 3rd Regiment lost its bomber when the random guy with a gun got a lucky shot, but the 53rd Elite Patrol is no more.

In other news, Yin's Empire forces a heavy trading embargo on the Greeks, rendering the Greek war machine virtually powerless.

The stock market continued to fall today at the news that Yin and China seem prepared for war.

---

posted June 16, 1999 07:18                

On an unrelated note, I'd love to see the name changing present in Smac.

Afterall, Istanbul was Constantinople. (Now it's Istanbul, not Constantinople. Why is it Istanbul, not Constantinople? I don't know. Even old New York was once New Amsterdam. Why'd they have to change their name? Maybe they like it better that way...)

posted June 16, 1999 12:22                

I wouldn't mind seeing the "paper," but I'd much rather see "encyclopedia" entries after a battle, personally. Maybe encyclopedia entries for ancient and renaissance battles, and newspapers for industrial and modern battles...? Or maybe not encyclopedia entries, but maybe "inscriptions" on a monument for ancient battles and "town cryers" for the renaissance...

posted June 17, 1999 07:08                

St. Petersburg became Leningrad, then Stalingrad, then St. Petersburg again. Interestingly enough, they change their name back to Stalingrad for 4 days every year, to honour the people who defended it in the second world war.

posted June 19, 1999 09:42                

Another idea came to mind: Empire names.

Instead of "The Chinese have built the Great Wall" let's have "The Chinese Empire has built the Great Wall".

Instead of "Spies report that the Freach and the Greeks have formed a pact", let's have "Spies report that the People's Republic of France, and the Kingdom of Greece have signed a pact."

These should be customizable by the player in the .txt files, just as the leader titles are. For example, instead of the default "Democratic Republic of America" we'd have the "United States of America" (Though the D.R.P sounds better, really ) Similarly, we wouldn't have "The People Republic of Russia" but "The U.S.S.R." There should be defaults, though. What do we call a communist america? Hard to tell, since there has never been one (yet ), but "the People's Republic of America" is a good guess. Sounds cool, too. Hrm... "Comrade Al?" "Chairman Bill?" I think that the US should have a revolution, just on the basis of sounding cooler.

Problems would be in researching all the info needed for accuracy. Also, have all civilizations had names for themselves? The mongols have Mongolia, the Germans Germany, but what about the Aztecs? The Sioux?

posted June 19, 1999 11:25                

Just seems cool to me. It would be a lot of fun.

posted June 19, 1999 20:47                

I also came up with the Olympics idea!!!1!!1!

But mine was AWSOME! Go away, Dan! Go away, Egg! B00! Hiss!

Editor's Note: NLT is tired, and it's late. He claims no responsibility for the stupidity of his words. Duh!!!!1!!

*sigh*

Never mind...

posted June 21, 1999 11:48                

(People are going to ignore me again, aren't they? Oh, well.)

posted June 21, 1999 12:42                

Here's a message for the results!

The [USA, Russia, Germany, Japan, etc.] defeats [Russia, USA, Rome, Greece, China, etc.] in [Ice Hockey, Basketball, 100 Meter Dash, Platform Diving, Field Hockey, etc.]!

posted June 21, 1999 17:02                

I just read bigbabarian's post, and I thought, hang on, we don't have barbarians in the 90's anymore, yet I had them in Civ2, so maybe we should have terrorists instead? When we reach a certain age. I don't know of any other idea's other than Terrorists, but yeah I like this idea.

posted June 21, 1999 17:39                

After all I would much prefer to play The Roman Imperium instead of Rome. Or the Empire of Great Britian instead of England or the Holy Roman Empire isntead of Germany. Or something off the wall such as the Greater Celtic Union of the Irish Nation.

posted June 21, 1999 21:04                

Anyway, I'm tying to keep our deadline for Brian: End of June. That doesn't give us me/us much time to get this summary in and polish it up. I'll have to do it myself if nobody wants to help, but that means the list will be late--and I want to get this list posted on Apolyton and on the desks at Firaxis ASAP!

(Let's see if THAT stirs somebody into action...please stir into action...somebody...Civ3, remember?...send in ideas...good idea? )

posted June 22, 1999 01:45                

There are several resons why "the end of June" syndrome is prevalent in my last post:

1) Brian expects it then. Sure. We could make him wait. No big deal.

The bigger issues:

2) The longer the list takes to complete, the less inclined people are to help see it finished or to keep posting ideas.

3) Right now Firaxis is most likely about to start some semi-formal idea gathering process of their own as they begin to make broad outlines of what Civ3 will be (although I'm sure this has been on the table since Civ2). So, THIS is the moment when our list has its most value--before too many things are set in stone. Obviously a list submitted a month before release is useless--and you count back from useless several months from now to crucial within the next few weeks.

There is no Orthodoxy here. There is only a group of very dedicated individuals who want these ideas to have their greatest possible impact on the development of Civ3.

Yes, "It's just a game." And we'd like it to be a good one.

posted June 22, 1999 03:07                

Can you tell I'm overworked? Well, this is a good reminder...I don't want to be like certain gaming companies and release a buggy List. Then we'd have to send in patches for months on end.

The list will be submitted when it's damn good and ready, I say! (But I reaaaaaalllly want to move on here...). Please help, those of you who have watched this process.

posted June 22, 1999 03:27             

I'd summarise it myself if I hadn't developed an irrational and probably misplaced loyalty to Dominique. And anyway, don't we love games because they don't have deadlines (i.e. unlike the things you should be doing instead of playing them)? Ipso, no deadlines would be Apolyton policy if I was CEO.

"Dim, through the misty vapour
and thick green light
I saw him:
guttering, choking, drowning."